I don't want a tab or button for everything. I want to primarily write text (i.e. code) but I also want it to be intelligent about what I'm writing - i.e. I want the autocomplete, the parameter hinting, the type checking (i.e. can't use the result of a void method, or can't do string ops on an array etc). I also want the option to have refactor helpers (moving methods, renaming methods, changing argument order, etc).

I've found IDEA (and before that PhpStorm, but it supports less plugins) are generally able to meet that need but you have to be careful about which plugins you install. I want Lua support, that doesn't mean I want a Lua console button in all projects.

I daily write in Xcode and that is very slimmed-down. In fact, Visual Studio developers typically hate it on first using it because there is only editors on the screen as opposed to property panes both sides of the editor!

And I would say that it is ONLY C++ is truly a benefit to QtCreator!! No use trying to be everything to everyone. Plus, C++ is the best language for everything isn't it? (I jest, I jest)

Unfortunately the only IDE's which seem to support languages I use and work on OS X are java based, and it seems the best option is IDEA or one of it's siblings.

Also, Eclipse tends to try to do everything in their IDE: Transition an issue, commit, execute a command-line program, browse the database, etc. It's a very different spirit from, say, SublimeText where each program is dedicated to one thing well. It has a lot of impact on the UI, hence the critics "Code is 40% of my screen". I personally prefer IDEA now because it comes with thin shims.

Btw, the HN rules say "No negativity". Just a reminder to be considerate for the Eclipse team.

Isn't that the whole point of an IDE? I mean, an Integrated Development Environment, by definition, should have all the tools integrated, as opposed to a text editor which is only one tool in an unintegrated development environment.

I prefer Emacs myself, but if I wanted an IDE, I'd probably go for the one that can do everything I want to do.

I have worked in IT services companies. They wrap almost a full OS into Eclipse (or WSAD). They have people who don't have a clue about programming [1], they need to onboard them and they do little to upgrade their knowledge. I used to wonder how architects learnt about Git and Maven, until the day I decided not to use IDE buttons, tried them on the command line and discovered "--help". It's all self-documented, output is all logged, I can debug compilation errors alone!

[1] Recruitment and HR is a cost center for consultancies. At one point they just took graduates from Chemistry major with a mild interest in Excel. Needless to say those who stayed became PMs. I've seen millions of euros from government, banks and insurances thrown into multiplying employees, rather than improving employees.

It's more like a tiling window manager

You can choose how many of those panels you have and which tabs are in each panel and which buttons you have in your toolbars.

> The actual code takes up like 40% of the screen.

considering that many projects still have guidelines regarding line-length (something around 80-120 characters) there's only so much horizontal space you can utilize. I can easily fit two source files side by side on my monitor and still have room for additional panels.

> Is this actually what programmers want from an IDE, or just what they have come to expect?

The more you can have on the screen at the same time the fewer permutations of arrangements you need for different tasks.

If we are to extend the desktop analogy, it's a work bench with a wall of tools hanging in front of you, every individual tool within grasping distance.

Mind you it's not just Eclipse, seem every IDE took their cue on how to do stuff from a VisualStudio from the 90's and decided it whas THE way to do it.

I still use Eclipse a lot (and Geany[0], for a lighter editor) -- the Code Indexer is the best I've ever tried. I can index the whole Linux Kernel in there, and it's a real blessing.

[0]: http://www.geany.org/

I don't understand how you can be stuck with that. You can close the panel, move it somewhere else or minimize it.

Eclipse does not force any particular layout on you.

You can even have 4 editor views side by side and only partition one of the 4 vertically to have the console at 1/4th width.

You don't, hide it via CSS[1]. Entire Eclipse UI is customizable. Install CSS Spy[2] to experiment live before committing changes.

My Eclipse setup actually looks like VIM with split buffers, there is nary a wasted pixel. To get to that point that though (e.g. hiding right side gutters and always-on scrollbars) is a bit more involved, need to take custom plugin route for that.

[1] http://stackoverflow.com/a/17027501/185840 [2] http://marketplace.eclipse.org/content/eclipse-4-tools-css-s...

disclaimer: I was responsible for the shell user interface of Visual Studio 2005 and 2008, but haven't worked for Microsoft for more than eight years or used any version of Visual Studio later than 2008. That said, I'm still rather anti-Eclipse.

I've since found out about Emacs and the contrast is striking; Emacs being a shining example of simplicity and extreme power while Eclipse is literally bloated boilerplate central in comparison.

This pretty much prevents me from taking anything coming out of the Eclipse Foundation seriously.

Yes, the purple and orange lettering on a black background is especially painful.

I'm not sure what to think about a "cloud IDE" yet. It strikes me as the sort of thing which, if it doesn't work perfectly, will break in mysterious ways. When such things break, it's usually necessary to look behind the pretty graphical environment at vast numbers of text files, environment variables, and whatever other state the thing has.

And things go both ways: Some of us do have multiple 30"+ monitors and appreciate UIs that manage to utilize all that space.

Remember that responsive design doesn't just mean scaling down to tiny mobile devices, it also means scaling up to large screens.

Those were concept drawings. In the finalized version, all of the panels & tabs are removable. There is a "+" in the tool bar that will let you add / remove any button, menu, panel entry. This is in the 4.0 branch that we are working on.